Article written by :: (RSS)

Helen has been writing at the Cast Iron Balcony since 2003. She has been a proud contributor to the Australian Group blogs Road to Surfdom, Larvatus Prodeo and Progressive Dinner Party. She's a blogger, she's a grinner, she's a mother, she's a sinner. She plays her music in the sun.

This author has written 34 posts for Hoyden About Town. Read more about Helen »

15 responses to “Australia’s Honour killings – In the end, they’re just as dead”

  1. tigtog

    Our honour killings may appear different in detail from the ones those Others perpetrate, but in the end, the women are just as dead.

    Sadly, so true.

    Very worthwhile reminder of exactly how far we have failed to come in “The West”.

  2. Paul Sunstone

    The sad thing is you’re right, Helen. I recall a couple World Health Organization reports that stated America has the highest rate of spousal murders among Western industrialized countries, but the problem doesn’t seem to be rare in any Western nation.

    What are the causes? There seem to be many. Certainly regarding women as property is a significant one. I’d also suggest our cultures often teach us that other people are responsible for our feelings — especially in matters of intimacy. Maybe we don’t take that notion so far as to make women wrap themselves head to foot in volumes of clothing on the theory they are responsible for our sexual feelings, but we do seem to take it far enough that many of us are prone to believe our partners can force us to be miserable if, say, they fall out of love with us.

  3. tigtog

    The fear of loneliness and the rage of disappointment can account for some of that misery, but the big kicker seems to be the social mirror: the idea that if a relationship doesn’t last together-forever that there must be something wrong with us because that’s what society says, instead of it being more pragmatically accepted as a social reality that it’s actually quite rare for people to share a wide range of priorities/goals/dreams for more than five years, let alone ten, twenty or fifty.

    Women are socialised from an early age into being told that there’s a whole lot of things wrong with womanhood and what women want: do women tend to accept the blame for a relationship breakdown more stoically, because it’s just one more thing that we’re doing wrong, eh? Whereas men are socialised to expect to be the decision-makers, and to have the decision taken out of their hands can for some be too great a shock to the system?

  4. Paul Sunstone

    Tigtog, your point about men being socialized to be decision-makers strikes me as spot on. It puts me in mind of the shock I felt when my first wife left me. “Shock” is an overused word, but perhaps there is no better for the disbelief I felt over the fact I had no say in her decision. My expectations were greatly out of whack with reality.

    I also think you make another very valid point: Although many of us remain happy in a very long relationship, the divorce rates — among other things — seem to indicate that at least half of us do not. I think there’s even a theory in one of the evolutionary sciences that we might have evolved to practice serial monogamy, for the most part. Relationships of about five to seven years, followed by a new partner. I don’t know how well supported that theory is, though, but it does seem to have some plausibility.

  5. grateful

    Every time I hear of another such killing I feel all of this in my gut, but haven’t had the chance to put together such a compelling and powerful, bang-on analysis. I am elated there’s someone out there telling this truth. I am printing your blog to use in my teaching.

  6. LKL

    Thanks for this. I hadn’t thought about spousal abuse/murder this way before, but it really makes sense.

  7. Helen

    Paul, that is interesting about the murder rate in the US; I couldn’t find any numbers but there are certainly plenty of reports and the dynamic seems to be similar in the US, UK and Australia. I think it’s difficult because, as with the DV stats, once someone is killed that gets amalgamated into the homicide stats. I’ll have a google for the WHO report, if you have a link to it already and could post it that would be great!

    TT – this: “Whereas men are socialised to expect to be the decision-makers, and to have the decision taken out of their hands can for some be too great a shock to the system.” Yes, this is the Western-style “honour” I’m positing – “loss of face” is another word for it.

    Grateful – What a lovely comment, thank you.

  8. LeonaDante

    Your article makes a poor argument. It is absolute arrogance that western “feminists” in the western world refuse to acknowledge the privilege of their birth and choose instead to claim that their society’s are just as violently oppressive or anywhere close to as violently oppressive as other cultures.

    As a foreign women who really did have to live with the pressures of arranged marriage and impossible barriers to divorce, the “pity us western gals” attitude you have disgusts me. There are 5000 honor killings in non western countries each year, vastly more than there are in the western world. These murders involve things like fathers burying daughters alive, chopping off noses etc. And what is worse is that unlike Australia, most of those murders are trivilized or ignored in total by law enforcement. It is perfectly santioned for male family owners to kill their female relatives whenever they want with no real fear of consequence.

    And it is worth pointing out that women like Julie end up in their situations in part because of their own choices. That was a man she chose to date and marry. The victims of real honor killings often never even have the choice to marry or not marry a violent husband. They are murdered even because of someone else spreading false rumors about them or because they are raped. And they are murdered by entire families and an entire society that conspires against them. In many parts of the Middle East I have been to, I see no women on the streets where there are many men. A world where women have no chance to make contacts outside the family that owns them is not comparable to the world Julie lived in. Mr. Ramage is identified as a person with a pathological sense of possession. Nearly every man in Yemen and Afghanistan feels the same level of possession that Ramage felt, but the difference is that there that sense is normal and proper and in Australia that sense is widely considered pathological and dangerous.

    Sure, Julie ended up just as dead as an honor killing victim. But there are far fewer such women in Australia, their victimizers go to jail and most importantly, no one sees the actions of John Ramage as a valid restoration of honor. In the Middle East, men that commit honor killings are congratulated for their bravery. Their was a case of a father parading his daughter’s head through the streets in Egypt as though it was something to be proud of- he must of had reason to believe others in the street would be proud of him. That’s why those are honor killings. Not only the murderers, but the whole society thinks the murder restores honor to the murderer. That is ultimately why Julie’s death is absolutely not an honor killing. It is not the western version of an honor killing. The western world thinks her murder was *shameful*

  9. Paul Sunstone

    Helen, the WHO report was cited by Jocelyn Elders, former Surgeon-General of the United States, in the foreword to a book by Judith Levine called, “Harmful to Minors”. I no longer have the book, so I don’t have the exact title of the report. If I recall, the report was from 2000. But I have since read of a more recent WHO report that found the US still led the Western world in spousal abuse and murder. I’m sorry I don’t have anything more than that for you to go on. When I tried to find the report on the net, I got swamped by other WHO reports and couldn’t find that specific one.

  10. Paul Sunstone

    @LeonaDante: Perhaps I misunderstood, but I didn’t take Helen as claiming the West was as violent towards women as other parts of the world. I understood her to be criticizing the popular Western attitude that we are generally above murdering our spouses — and that such events are increasingly rare. As such, I think she has a case.

  11. blue milk

    This is a terrific post – loved its clear-headed arguments, loved its reframing of tragic recent events. Thanks for posting it.

  12. Katja

    I do agree that the hundreds of murders of spouses in the Western world are symptomatic for misogyny and a very patriarchic concept of the man being the owner of his wife hence ending up with the idea “if I can’t have her, noone will”.

    Still, honour killings for me have a different notion. They are performed not by him (husband, boyfriend…), but by her family. The concept of honour that is thought to be recovered is much less a man’s but a family’s. And I do believe that we need a totally different approach trying to prevent those cases.

    In muslim countries btw there are both concepts popular. And you’re absolutely right: They both leave women dead or mutilated and traumatized… Betrayed by those who should help to protect them.

  13. Legs

    Really great post, this is something I think a lot about so it is wonderful to see someone writing so competently about the subject. Thank you!

The commenting period has expired for this post. If you wish to re-open the discussion, please do so in the latest Open Thread.